CnC World War II
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CnC World War II

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Big Eye Small Mouth

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1Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Big Eye Small Mouth Fri Oct 04, 2013 12:12 pm

Leetin McBeatin

Leetin McBeatin

I have been reading forum about the game and found on that has "David Pulver" contributing. He is the author and on the front cover of the book.

His opinion on the 3rd edition was that after being fired (company went under) they made some changes. Below is a list of rules that e felt should of existed in the new edition: Source: Forum

If I had total control:

(1). Generally follow BESM 2nd edition revised in all respects, except:

(2). Without the full-scale point inflation of 3e, carefully consider an increase (perhaps doubling) of stat costs and a +10-15 increase in base point, or just using the optional Staged Stat Costs of the 2e revised as the standard rule.

(3) Add a few more social attributes, skills, and defects; Mark was rather stingy with them due to his design philosophy, but I prefer that non-combat characters get some extra things to spend points on.

(4). Possibly consider adding a 7th level to the six-level attributes running with six levels to allow for some more cosmic effects.

(5) Fix a few specific attributes. In particular, I prefer BESM 3e's Mind Control and believe it also had slightly better Companion rules (Servant was not that useful in2e).

(6). Deal with the combat issue. BESM 2e combat was somewhat unbalanced because the 2d6 roll-low system was not originally intended to have skills added onto it, resulting in excessive fight durations. Various options exist to mitigate this, all of them reasonable:
- make critical attack (which beats a normal defense) on any roll of half or less
- go to a roll high system, basically reversing the modifiers
- keep the system as is but cap skills at 3 levels
Etc. Playtesting to determine which would work best; I've tried all three with various degrees of success.

(7). As 3e did, drop the "positive numbers are bad, negative are good" values

(Cool. Clean up a lot of the cruft (which 3e did) like the bad variable damage optoinal rule (replace with a simple "roll 1d6 per 5 points" or something like that.

(9). From BESM 3e, include a few of the additional custom weapon abilities/disabilities. Add the Dimensional Travel/Walk attribute, some of

(10). One radical change: consider replacing the three stats with four, splitting Body into Body (now as strength/toughness) and Reflexes. That way: Mind and Reflexes are mental and physical quickness and Body and Soul and physical and mental strength. And you can dump a whole bunch of clumsy rules that exist to add dubious sub-stats.

(11). Consider actually restoring some of the container attributes (Cybernetic Body) from the original version, albeit with some better play balance.

(12) Rewrite the Game Mechanics to start with a section on skills outside of combat, and then follow through with combat.

(13) Add a few extra options for realistic higher-lethality combat for those who want it.

(14). Properly cover normal animals, something BESM 2e left out (like, horses and stuff).

(15). Boost the level of anime genre emulation rules and discussion of particular anime sub-genres in general. I was quite happy with that in 3e (e.g, the extra shojo section) though it didn't got quite far enough and wasn't really integrated with the attributes or mechanics as well as it could have been.

(16). Drop the idea of an incorporated multi-verse. I was quite happy with the worlds themselves as individual campaign settings (and enjoyed creating them) but never keen on the idea of an "anime multi-verse" is both a bit clumsy and something that seems to have leaked in from Mark's love of Amber and their general emphasis on superhero multiverses from SAS.

Anyway, that's mostly off-the-cuff. My general feeling is that 2e has rough edges in some game balance areas, but I found it was fun, Moreover, as many people know, as well as anime I enjoy hard sf, and 2e could do that without offending me. On the other hand, 3e had all kinds of clumsy bits that blew my suspension of disbelief (Mark's "armor table" on p. 20 is a particular example... uh, yeah, the doors of a family car are as tough as modern heavy body armor which is equal to chainmail and a breast plate...special GM permission needed for armor equal to a tank or mecha (Hello, isn't this anime where these things can be common?!). Etc.
Grumble, grumble. Oh well, pretty looking book, anyway!

2Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Fri Oct 04, 2013 1:22 pm

The Reality Tailor

The Reality Tailor

Or we could just play CnC.

3Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:15 pm

Leetin McBeatin

Leetin McBeatin

I second that vote!!

See if I always say lets play C&C cause this system (3.0-4.0) sux it makes me seem like Jimmy. Since others say it i can agree.

In reality the system does have its strong points, we just need to house rules them into our current C&C houz rules game.

Is'nt that the point of playing multiple RPG's? take the best and leave the rest behind.

4Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:33 pm

The Reality Tailor

The Reality Tailor

To be honest, I've never been in a game where we played by the "rules". We always have house rules to make the game flow and stay interesting. Personally, even when we started with 3.5, I hated skill points. I thought there had to be a better way, then low and behold, Siege Engine. And with a bit of tweaking, we could do all this stuff in CnC. I'm not saying that system is perfect either. Personally I don't like the armor system in any game we've played, except BESM. By the time you get to say plate mail, your enemies have a +10 to hit. So your armor always feels like it's inadequate. In this you get a defense roll, and if you fail armor mitigates damage (usually). But like you said- take the best out of any systems guidelines (rules seems an inaccurate term), and combine them into your own system. It just happens that because of it's simplicity (and Siege Engine mechanic) that CnC would seem to be the best base for it.

Damn, I almost sound smart...creepy.

5Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 08, 2013 2:45 pm

The Serpent

The Serpent

C&C is a great system but as Alan pointed out(I think in this thread) we always use House Rules the system into something we all enjoy. To turn C&C into a more BESM like game I feel would be a waste. C&C is a good system and its merits stand alone and doesn't need something as extreme as BESM though a modern or futuristic game based on the Siege Engine would be sexy. That game wouldn't actually be C&C.

What out of BESM would you guys want to see in a modern/futuristic Siege Engine game?

6Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:11 pm

Leetin McBeatin

Leetin McBeatin

FEATS, with out a Doubt FEATS. imagine what FEATs will accomplish in that system. I also think FEATS will balance out C&C.

I have been very interested in a no so mid-evil C&C setting.



We are speaking of BESm not 3.? in general??

What does it have:

Attributes
Def Roll
Goofy gameplay anime style
FEATS...naa tha be 3.0025

I know there has to be more that Is left out by me?? PHIL??

7Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:27 pm

The Reality Tailor

The Reality Tailor

So I was thinking about how to answer this, and I've realized the thing I enjoy most about this game is the story. Mechanics wise, there isn't much I can think of. I like the defense concept, although I think that could be tweaked. And I also like the thought of armor just being armor, instead of adding to AC. As I've said before, in other games by the time you get to the good armor (+6 and up), most everything is swinging for +10. But after our little side game on Saturday, I truly believe that too many rules ruins the game (on the other hand, so does not having proper boundaries). Overall, I personally can't think of any specific mechanic at all that makes me go, oh yeah that rocks.

8Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:54 pm

deathmvp

deathmvp

For the most part BESM is just the D&D 3.x using certen options form book that are already in and then the powers added.

One optional 3.5 rule that the Evil god would probly like is the VP/WP system. Vp would be HP can your WP is your Con score. All Crits go to the WP (no multiplyer). This way even at high level a wepon can kill you. There is more to it but that is the gist of it.

http://http:\\deathmvp.tripod.com

9Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:07 pm

Leetin McBeatin

Leetin McBeatin

So FEATS are not BESM?

10Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:11 pm

The Reality Tailor

The Reality Tailor

There are a few feats from BESM that could be adapted, but most of them are adapted to work with the skill points.

11Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 08, 2013 6:28 pm

Leetin McBeatin

Leetin McBeatin

Ohh, soo FEATS are BESM!

12Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:06 pm

The Serpent

The Serpent

Feats are 3.5 and 3.0. I can't see any aspect of BESM or 3.5 that I would bring over to C&C to make it better the Siege Engine has a simple complexity that things like Feats will just hinder.

13Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:20 pm

The Reality Tailor

The Reality Tailor

House Rules DQ!!! cheers 

14Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 15, 2013 12:27 pm

The Serpent

The Serpent

Pick A Card wrote:House Rules DQ!!! cheers 
That's how I role. House Rules DQ. I actually think that this would be the best system to transfer Nightmare Moon to, it would also probably be more fun too.

15Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Tue Oct 15, 2013 2:54 pm

Leetin McBeatin

Leetin McBeatin

Agreed, CC has a different style that BESDQ.

Also is there a rule in either system that helps you flesh out HERO GODS!!

16Big Eye Small Mouth Empty Re: Big Eye Small Mouth Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:26 pm

Drunk Flogger

Drunk Flogger

when we switching to DQ or CNC?

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